Rather, Ahithophel must be the close friend, since he was Davids counselor. No, Jesus was not the first son of David and Bathsheba. You killed him with the sword of the Ammonites. Excuse me author but can you also respond to the claims that a sheep ate the Quran. There is virtual consensus among the commentators that the meaning of this phrase is that Davids betrayers would not live half as long as people normally lived at the time. So, either way, it seems that the name in 1 Chronicles 11:36 was a textual corruption, and thus, unreliable. A minority of scholars questioned the application of the psalm to Ahithophel. If the historical David (peace be upon him) had indeed married Bathsheba at such a young age (without committing adultery), the marriage would not have been consummated until she was physically mature, which would have been at the onset of puberty. They will vociferously deny that Bathsheba was around 7 years old (or perhaps as old as 9) when she first encountered David and they will deny that she was the granddaughter of Ahithophel. He betrayed David by joining Absaloms revolt. Since this is now firmly established, we may ask what relevance it has in determining Bathshebas age at the time of her marriage to David. Yet, this objection is based on some flawed premises: why is it assumed that Ahithophel needed to be older than David? Bekldve: 2022. mjus 29. vasrnap Szerz: . WebBathshebas husband Uriah was back to war, so they were married over a year. The traditional ascription to David cannot on any ground be maintained. Contrast Bathshebas husband Uriah to Abigails husband Nabal. [61], Thus, it is reasonable to conclude that Ahithophel must have died at a relatively young age. [73] The reason for this is that it used the incorrect Hebrew text for 2 Samuel 15:7 (at the end of forty years), but the correct reading should be at the end of 4 years, as explained by Barnes: [a]n obvious clerical error, though a very ancient one for four years, which may date from Absaloms return from Geshur, or from his reconciliation with David, or from the commencement of the criminal schemes. She was but a young woman, the wife of a foreigner; David was the king. Medium: Oil on wood. There is an obvious contradiction. 2 One evening, David got up from his couch and was pacing back and forth on the roof of the palace. Accession Number: 14.40.651. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. So, we should follow Muhammads example and only allow marriage at an age that is appropriate for the time. Bullingers Companion Bible Notes,[17] Gary H. Everetts Study Notes on the Holy Scriptures,[18] George Haydocks Catholic Bible Commentary,[19] the Jamiesson-Fausset-Brown Commentary,[20] John Trapps Complete Commentary,[21] Ironsides Notes on Selected Books,[22] L.M. I swear on your very life,[d] I will not do that!. David was sinful because he had taken another mans wife, not that he had slept with a 7-year old. The name Eliam is only mentioned twice in the, But 1 Chronicles 11:36 gives the alternate name for Eliam, the son of Ahithophel as Ahijah the Pelonite, so he cannot be the same person as the father of Bathsheba!, Third, if Ahijah is an alternate name for Eliam, it still does not refute the claim that Eliam was the son of Ahithophel and the father of Bathsheba, simply because the Chronicler does not provide any additional information. bloody and deceitful mendo not come up to. Though this is said to be a prayer of Moses, who probably lived some 250 years before the reign of David, it still finds corroboration in the time of David, since Barzillai was 80 years old at the time of Absaloms revolt, and David himself lived for 70 years. Yes, this is certainly possible, but where is the evidence from the Bible? Ironically, the evidence comes from the life of her. This illustrates that Ahithophel was probably a young man (Source: This brings us to the most crucial point of our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age. In a previous article, I demonstrated that the Bible generally allowed marriage and sex at the onset of puberty (with the exception of Numbers 31:18 which seemingly allowed sex even before puberty). The oldest man in the Bible, after the patriarchs, was Jehoiada, who supposedly died at the age of 130 (2 Chronicles 24:15). [1] https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2020/06/10/the-age-of-marriage-in-the-bible/. [63] Finally, he returned to Giloh and hanged himself after Absalom failed to take his advice. Uriah. [80] For example, see the Morrish Bible Dictionary, https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/mbd/e/eliam-.html. This brings us to the most crucial point of our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age. 24. Despite the loss of Temple Judaism in 70 AD, Redemptive Judeo-Christianity will triumph. It should also be borne in mind that David was a prophet, as stated in Acts 2:30: But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that he would place one of his descendants on his throne.. David asked his servants Wiki User. A child who died in infancy without a name. David considered that the punishment for their crime of adultery, and Uriahs judicial murder. The seco Michal (/mxl/; Hebrew: [mial], Greek: ) was, according to the first Book of Samuel, a princess of the United Kingdom of Israel; the younger daughter of King Saul, she was the first wife of David (1 Samuel 18:2027), who later became king, first of Judah, then of Israel. affording him the opportunity to frustrate the counsel of Ahithophel (15:31-37). No, this is not a tu quoque fallacy, which is defined as: an informal fallacy that intends to discredit the opponents argument by asserting the opponents failure to act consistently in accordance with its conclusion(s).[79]. Thus, while marriage at the onset of puberty was not unusual, the Bible indicates that both marriage and sexual intercourse were sometimes permitted at very young ages (though this does not appear to be the norm). Furthermore, as stated, David himself was 70 years old at the time of his death. She was two years old, on our scheme, when David became king. This illustrates that Ahithophel was probably a young man (Source: https://bibleatlas.org/giloh.htm). Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. We have already seen evidence in a previous article that the marriage was Biblically valid. However, this does not fit well due to the contradiction between Sauls age at the time of his death and Davids prophecy in Psalm 55:23. It reads like a song of the time of Absalom and Ahithophel. Even knowing she was Or Ammiel, [1 Chronicles 3:5] who was the son of Ahithophel, [2 Samuel 23:34] who might, for the dishonour done by David to his niece Bathsheba, be the readier to conspire against him, and to take part with Absalom., [22] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/isn/psalms-41.html#1, Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba., [23] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/lmg/2-samuel-15.html#1, The reason for this strong enmity was likely that Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba, [24] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/mac/2-samuel-12.html#13, He was Bathshebas grandfather; and we are not going wrong, I think, in tracing his passionate hatred, and the peculiar form of insult which he counselled Absalom to adopt, to the sense of foul wrong which had been done to his house by Davids crime., [25] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tsk/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam: 11:3; 15:31; 17:23; 1 Chronicles 27:33,34, [26] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tbi/2-samuel-12.html#14, What swept Ahithophel into the ranks of that great conspiracy? Note that the Bible describes Bathsheba at this time as very beautiful (2 Samuel 11:2) and David was overcome with feelings of lust for her! [4] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. From this rapid survey of the general calamity, David turns to the chief supporter of the rebellion, his former chief counsellor. And, if we allow the psalm to be Davids, we can scarcely give any other explanation. It is not impossible that this Eliam is the same as the preceding., [88] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/e/eliam.html, The same name Eliam also occurs as that of a Gilonite, the son of Ahithophel, and one of Davids thirty warriors (2 Samuel 23:34). He hanged himself after realizing that the revolt would fail. Read 2 Samuel 11:6-25. Brother can you refute this also. Moreover, according to the Fausset Dictionary, Ahijah the Pelonite was probably a corruption of text. [6] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/smiths-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html, [7] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ats/a/ahithophel.html, Ahithophel seems to have been the grandfather of Bathsheba., [8] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/a/ahithophel.html, Ahithophel was the mainspring of the rebellion. This would be based on physical and social maturity. When she came to him, he had sex with her. He never kept time or season with God, and surely God will not keep or regard his time or season., In the Jewish account threescore years was the age of a man, and death at any time before that was looked upon as untimely, The more sins we do commit, the more we hasten our own death; because as the wise man saith, The fear of the Lord prolongeth days, but the years of the wicked shall be shortened (Pro 10:27); and the prophet David saith, Bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days; for sin is an epitomiser or shortener of everything: it consumes our wealth, it confines our liberty, it impeaches our health, and it abbreviates our life, and brings us speedily unto our grave., [61] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/wen/psalms-55.html#23, But shall be cut off by an untimely and violent death., David was thirty years old when he became king, and he reigned forty years., Saul was thirty years old when he became king, and he reigned over Israel forty-two years.. Psychologist Dr. Robert Epstein has made the controversial suggestion that young people, regardless of how young, should be allowed to make decisions about marriage and sex provided that they demonstrate that he or she knows about the risks of sexis physically and emotionally mature, and so on, an arbitrary age cutoff necessarily allows incompetent people to gain rights and privileges they probably shouldnt have., The norm that the ulama did come to consensus on was only a general guideline: they prohibited sexual intercourse for girls not able to undergo it, on the basis that otherwise sex could be physically harmful. Bathsheba, a name that to many, means seduction and sin, a name to remain unspoken! [48] http://blb-ra.blueletterbible.org/mcgee_j_vernon/Psa/19134_Psalm_55_1-5.mp3 (mark 1:45). Learn how your comment data is processed. See the same link to the playlist. However, that is, Perhaps Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite is different from Eliam, the father of Bathsheba.. 22. on 2 Samuel 11:3, and 1 Chronicles 3:5) is that the two Eliams are the same person. I believe that you have misunderstood my comment. Though this is said to be a prayer of Moses, who probably lived some 250 years before the reign of David, it still finds corroboration in the time of David, since Barzillai was 80 years old at the time of Absaloms revolt, and David himself lived for 70 years. That Ahitophel is the subject of Psalm 55:12-14; Psalm 55:20-21, is contrary to all we know of the history of the rebellion of Absalom (, There is no hint that the writer is a king whose authority is threatened by a formidable insurrection. Indeed, this is highly unlikely given that Barzillai the Gileadite, who was 80 years old at the time of the revolt and was a supporter of David, was not willing to cross the Jordan river with David to go to Jerusalem from Mahanaim after Absaloms defeat and death because he was too old.[65]. The traditional ascription to David cannot on any ground be maintained. There is simply no reason to make assume otherwise, other than to avoid the embarrassment of finding out Bathshebas true age. This is confirmed by 1 Kings 15:5, which states (emphasis ours): David had done what was right in the eyes of the Lord and had not failed to keep any of the Lords commands all the days of his lifeexcept in the case of Uriah the Hittite.. Bathsheba Survives NavPress Miranda approaches her twenty-seventh birthday determined to reinvent her life and He didnt lure her. Since David died when he was 70 years old, it means that he was 50 years old when Bathsheba (911 years old) gave birth to Solomon. I dont think Mohamad was saying he believes those things (?). He states that: an arbitrary age cutoff necessarily allows incompetent people to gain rights and privileges they probably shouldnt have.[101]. Note that this is the most conservative estimate. WebAPI Access. It should be noted that the Bible does not state Bathsheba was _ years old. It only criticizes the explanation of Ahithophels possible motive for helping Absalom (i.e., revenge for Davids sinful act with Bathsheba and the murder of Uriah the Hittite). Hehehe, you guys are really funny. [68] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. He didnt go down to his own house. Moreover, according to the, Ahijah the Pelonite appears in 2 Samuel 23:34 as Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite, of which, But David was not a role model for all times! with 2 Samuel 23:34)., [14] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bnb/2-samuel-11.html#3, Bath-sheba was the granddaughter of Ahithophel 2 Samuel 23:34., [15] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bcc/2-samuel-12.html#1, He had no pity for the beautiful young Bathsheba whom he ordered to his bed. The Woman Was Very Beautiful: The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Bible, Originally posted on the Quran and Bible Blog, From the roof he saw a woman bathing. According to Psalm 90:10: Our days may come to seventy years, or eighty, if our strength endures;. Now, therefore, the sword will never depart from your house, because you despised me and took the wife of Uriah the Hittite to be your own.[77]. 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